I have no axe to grind with SH or AJ.
I am beginning to get the feeling though, that AJ gets into these threads to keep the SH name being bandied about. Why else would one rehash and go over the same answers to the same questions and end up with all parties having the same opinion that they initially held. It's circular logic at it's finest.
I'd much rather have AJ post his particular thoughts on the pros and cons of every generation of CR500AF that he has built. I bet I would learn a thing or two.
CR500AF Name - Trademark or Just Words
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Ported&Polished
- Posts: 1898
- Joined: June 23rd, 2007, 12:47 pm
- Location: Prescott
I have something to say too. Who gives a fawk? I wanna see the day when I see this AJ guy post something cool on a post where someone is building their own AF! I tried to find a post by him in the other sections of this board, guess what, he hasn't! Well except for a politics one and a couple introduction posts. How about a post by him in the food and drink section? Or one in the ride reports? Nope, it's always here in the AF section. Cut it out, you remind me of FREEMER with posts that have some kind of angle or agenda. What are you 12 years old? "I'm gonna search that Banned board for something posted about me" Grow up.
Don't Clyde it, ride it!
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iggys-amsoil
- Posts: 3602
- Joined: June 1st, 2007, 6:09 pm
- Location: Just North of March Airfield CA
bob stated
and as such why dint you inform the original poster he was silly to be "pissed " about anything at all?
to avoid th edrama of a few individsuals that do not understand IP trademark law.SH should register thier already owned trademarks.
and if they have already applied for the registered TM,
they should someohow hasten the process to appease those who dont understand IP law in the first place??
got it.
attraction to the drama?
random people, who are not in the business get "pissed" about a trademark
I clarify it,.
and simply ask WHY they would even care? much less be pissed?
isnt that far more legitimate question than any other question here?
why do they care bob?
most understandibly dont.?
bob if someone posted that they dint like your haircut, and that it really pissed them off.
youd likely ask them why? as your haircut seems quite normal enough..?
its really that simple, i dont understand why people care so i ask them the obvious question.
i understand those that dont..that makes complete sense.
it also makes sense i would find it interesting why some do?
as far as drama ,, LOL,.. you have personally posted plenty of drama.
give me a break bob..
i can't point it out?
*a little story* comes to mind.
and many other posts.
i asked a fair enough question here.
why does the original poster care?
instead of theories or ideas on why he might..
why i would post , or my motives for doing so,
are questioned,debated and ridiculed..
to flippin funny man....!!
the most amusing part is I simply noticed the thread,
naturally found it interesting why it even bothered the guy.
and just wanted to know why on earth it would?
heaven forbid i simply asked him..?
and clarify why it shouldn't.
we agree, in concept if not particulars.I understand Trademark Law perfectly. I understand the concept that your "Trademark", while un-registered, is valid and defendable in the eye of the courts.
and as such why dint you inform the original poster he was silly to be "pissed " about anything at all?
so let me get this straight bob,What I dont understand is your attraction to the drama surrounding the name. If you took the time to REGISTER it, their would be no debate..... period.
to avoid th edrama of a few individsuals that do not understand IP trademark law.SH should register thier already owned trademarks.
and if they have already applied for the registered TM,
they should someohow hasten the process to appease those who dont understand IP law in the first place??
got it.
attraction to the drama?
random people, who are not in the business get "pissed" about a trademark
I clarify it,.
and simply ask WHY they would even care? much less be pissed?
isnt that far more legitimate question than any other question here?
why do they care bob?
most understandibly dont.?
bob if someone posted that they dint like your haircut, and that it really pissed them off.
youd likely ask them why? as your haircut seems quite normal enough..?
its really that simple, i dont understand why people care so i ask them the obvious question.
i understand those that dont..that makes complete sense.
it also makes sense i would find it interesting why some do?
as far as drama ,, LOL,.. you have personally posted plenty of drama.
give me a break bob..
i can't point it out?
*a little story* comes to mind.
and many other posts.
i asked a fair enough question here.
why does the original poster care?
instead of theories or ideas on why he might..
why i would post , or my motives for doing so,
are questioned,debated and ridiculed..
to flippin funny man....!!
the most amusing part is I simply noticed the thread,
naturally found it interesting why it even bothered the guy.
and just wanted to know why on earth it would?
heaven forbid i simply asked him..?
and clarify why it shouldn't.
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Slow old Fart
- Posts: 444
- Joined: February 12th, 2008, 6:19 am
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britincali
- Posts: 8207
- Joined: May 31st, 2007, 7:10 pm
- Location: Barstow, CA
Ported&Polished wrote:I tried to find a post by him in the other sections of this board, guess what, he hasn't! Well except for a politics one and a couple introduction posts. How about a post by him in the food and drink section? Or one in the ride reports? Nope, it's always here in the AF section. Cut it out, you remind me of FREEMER with posts that have some kind of angle or agenda. What are you 12 years old? "I'm gonna search that Banned board for something posted about me" Grow up.
come on man...serisously. AJ isn't your fishing buddy. Or any of ours for that matter. Don't be upset that he doesn't watch your kids and buy you beer. We all scour this site for particular threads and post when we think we can add something. Myself for instance, I haven't looked but at maybe four topics here, or the other site. And if anyone of us here can call themselves a MAN...I'd expect him to post anywhere anytime regarding himself or his business. And this topic pertained to non other than AJ Waggoner himself. The individual who posted this topic needs a tampon. They're cheap, easy to find and can help bloody noses and open wounds. There's a lot of good information on this site. This subject is NOT one of them. Lets burn this dead horse for good and be on with it. It's a pitty so many of us even replied. I'm going to choke myself for doing so and I suggest all of you who this doesn't apply to do the same. This thread makes us look like bitches...myself included.'03 CR500 powered by...umm...a new motor?
Bob-
dispute? by a few folks that dont understand IP law,,
but if they ever contacted an attorney to find out ,
they would be put striaght.
so it's very VERY little dispute?
other than on a few random net forums?
That particular SH trademark was applied for long ago.
when you know the process, what it entails, and how long it takes to put the little r @ or TM by an already owned trademark, in this application.
you would understand?
but you are right-
untill then a few guys will hold me and SH in "disdain"
because of lack of understandin of the process,and of IP law itself.
I reply a few times when they seem over the top?
(like this guy did, go read hios original post?)
no big deal..and just because i follow up doesnt mean its all "drama" to me? its simply interesting.
no big deal to anyone really?
i do notice still nowone is wondering why the guy was so upset,
or holds me in "disdain?
thats seems a pretty strong emotion..for a guy not in this business to have ?
especially about some silly name i came up with long ago? if he's that strong in his feelings, a simple call by him to any IP expert would have cleared it up quickly.
but i should jum thru som ehoop or another s ohe can sleep better at night without disdain in his heart?
LOL
ok.ok..
ou812- i have no chip on my shoulder at all?
i'm not even slightly upset? where do you guys get this perception?
because i reply?
i hav esome time to..and i'm just amused some random dude out there,
would be pissed about something like this,I find the followup posts amusing mostly,,and was just hoping he could clarify why it even bothered him?(i am genuinely curious,wouldnt yo be in my shoes?)
i just thought it a simple thing to ask him. guess not.
i went riding today with my boy, had a great time,
looking at the weathet for tomorow, and thought i'd see where this thread further spun off too? why not?
As far as typing/spelling, yea i suck.it's true!!
(i blame it on the many concussions ive had,but the rerality is a just suck at typing)
as far as you telling me that i better get my act together?
i've no chip on my shoulder about that either?
heck why would i? because you're right,
i should make an effort to type better.
i'll be honest it likely wont happen..though, and i'll continue to stink at it.
i'm too laid back for my own good sometimes..oh well..
slow old fart-
CRF airbox details?
Why dont you ask danny graves?
he asked me ahile back?,and i gave him all the info i could on it long ago.
he understood i ca nonly detaill so much, and was appreciative of what i could share, just like shannon has been in the past on lots of other questions, as well as many posters here.
no good deed goes unpunished though ..LOL
Hope you all have a good fathers day, i plan to.
dispute? by a few folks that dont understand IP law,,
but if they ever contacted an attorney to find out ,
they would be put striaght.
so it's very VERY little dispute?
other than on a few random net forums?
That particular SH trademark was applied for long ago.
when you know the process, what it entails, and how long it takes to put the little r @ or TM by an already owned trademark, in this application.
you would understand?
but you are right-
untill then a few guys will hold me and SH in "disdain"
because of lack of understandin of the process,and of IP law itself.
I reply a few times when they seem over the top?
(like this guy did, go read hios original post?)
no big deal..and just because i follow up doesnt mean its all "drama" to me? its simply interesting.
no big deal to anyone really?
i do notice still nowone is wondering why the guy was so upset,
or holds me in "disdain?
thats seems a pretty strong emotion..for a guy not in this business to have ?
especially about some silly name i came up with long ago? if he's that strong in his feelings, a simple call by him to any IP expert would have cleared it up quickly.
but i should jum thru som ehoop or another s ohe can sleep better at night without disdain in his heart?
LOL
ok.ok..
ou812- i have no chip on my shoulder at all?
i'm not even slightly upset? where do you guys get this perception?
because i reply?
i hav esome time to..and i'm just amused some random dude out there,
would be pissed about something like this,I find the followup posts amusing mostly,,and was just hoping he could clarify why it even bothered him?(i am genuinely curious,wouldnt yo be in my shoes?)
i just thought it a simple thing to ask him. guess not.
i went riding today with my boy, had a great time,
looking at the weathet for tomorow, and thought i'd see where this thread further spun off too? why not?
As far as typing/spelling, yea i suck.it's true!!
(i blame it on the many concussions ive had,but the rerality is a just suck at typing)
as far as you telling me that i better get my act together?
i've no chip on my shoulder about that either?
heck why would i? because you're right,
i should make an effort to type better.
i'll be honest it likely wont happen..though, and i'll continue to stink at it.
i'm too laid back for my own good sometimes..oh well..
slow old fart-
CRF airbox details?
Why dont you ask danny graves?
he asked me ahile back?,and i gave him all the info i could on it long ago.
he understood i ca nonly detaill so much, and was appreciative of what i could share, just like shannon has been in the past on lots of other questions, as well as many posters here.
no good deed goes unpunished though ..LOL
Hope you all have a good fathers day, i plan to.
I didnt know you had a Son AJ..... cool.AJ wrote: I went riding today with my boy, had a great time,
Talk about a being a " Kid in the candy store...."
Does he get to go "backstage" with you to Supercross type events....
Good times!
As far as the info that you share (and I would like to think I speak for everyone on this matter) ..we are all grateful.
While you and I dont always see eye to eye AJ, I deeply respect you for answering many of the questions you receive from homebuilders.
AlisoBob wrote:AJ wrote: I went riding today with my boy, had a great time,
As far as the info that you share (and I would like to think I speak for everyone on this matter) ..we are all grateful.
While you and I dont always see eye to eye AJ, I deeply respect you for answering many of the questions you receive from homebuilders.
"the game of life of is not so much in holding a good hand as playing a poor hand well"-
Slow old Fart
- Posts: 444
- Joined: February 12th, 2008, 6:19 am
AJ thanks for keeping the 500 alive and getting it the exposure worldwide we need so maybe somebody will build one one day with a modern 500 2 smoke engine so we can see a truly great open bike.
The 500 power plant is dated, I remember 20 years ago how the 250's were and how much smoother the newer 250' are compared to the ones of the eighties. If we can plant a seed for somebody to build a modern 500 cc smoker we would truly have great bikes.
The 500 power plant is dated, I remember 20 years ago how the 250's were and how much smoother the newer 250' are compared to the ones of the eighties. If we can plant a seed for somebody to build a modern 500 cc smoker we would truly have great bikes.
AJ,
I really enjoyed your history of the AF thread. I understand that you probably cannot post for public consumption the bad points of all the generations, so to not devalue the SH bikes that are in the consumers hands, but could you give a synopsis of the good points of each generation and maybe certain issues that you ran into building each?
I really enjoyed your history of the AF thread. I understand that you probably cannot post for public consumption the bad points of all the generations, so to not devalue the SH bikes that are in the consumers hands, but could you give a synopsis of the good points of each generation and maybe certain issues that you ran into building each?
Money ain't got no owners, only spenders - Omar Little
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Slow old Fart
- Posts: 444
- Joined: February 12th, 2008, 6:19 am
One thing you have to take into consideration when evaluating the way a bike handels is what type of conditions are you riding in. One bike may work great for one area and not another.Exnav wrote:AJ,
I really enjoyed your history of the AF thread. I understand that you probably cannot post for public consumption the bad points of all the generations, so to not devalue the SH bikes that are in the consumers hands, but could you give a synopsis of the good points of each generation and maybe certain issues that you ran into building each?
C'mon you guys!!! Give the dude a break already. 
I think he has heard all your opinions, and done yoman's duty explaining his own perspective on just about everything he can. (legally or otherwise) Maybe it's time everyone just tip your cap to him and go on your way whether you intend to own a SH AF or build your own?
As far as chronicling (sp?) the various generations and the pro's and con's of each, well it seems to me that you can reread all the magazine test articles of each of those chassis when they debuted and assume that the AF would have enjoyed most of those same technological advancements and the shortcomings as well. Right?
Of course, with the addition of the CR500 mill with it's additional 7 lbs. (static) and increased gyro-effect, the chassis would be slightly encumbered, but for the most part, each AF would be better than the last. (personal setups for terrain and rider preferences not withstanding).
I think he has heard all your opinions, and done yoman's duty explaining his own perspective on just about everything he can. (legally or otherwise) Maybe it's time everyone just tip your cap to him and go on your way whether you intend to own a SH AF or build your own?As far as chronicling (sp?) the various generations and the pro's and con's of each, well it seems to me that you can reread all the magazine test articles of each of those chassis when they debuted and assume that the AF would have enjoyed most of those same technological advancements and the shortcomings as well. Right?
Of course, with the addition of the CR500 mill with it's additional 7 lbs. (static) and increased gyro-effect, the chassis would be slightly encumbered, but for the most part, each AF would be better than the last. (personal setups for terrain and rider preferences not withstanding).
Last edited by ShanMan on June 15th, 2008, 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
CR500AC widget maker
exnav-
I have put together that list before..(on a few forums)
i'll try to do so soon here. an dpost in a nother thread, i'm siure lots of guys have input on other chassis as well?
but essentially its much as Shannon stated,
each generation is a bit better.
in some gens/years its dramaticly better, ,
others gens/years just a slight improvement.
as slow old fart said-
for the exact type of riding one might prefer on egen to another though.
me? i do really like the gen 4 (CRF250) the best-
and especially the 08 , with the 22mm offset triples..
personally i feel that year simply out handles everything else , bar none.
its forgiving in set up , ergos are great for a motocross sized dude like me (5'8 150 pounds on a good rainy day)
i'm completely in love with the 08 (CRF250R) chassis,and it works remarkably well with the 500 tossed in it.you can pretty easily knife inside any thumper out there.
There where years that i really liked and could get dialed, but were less forgiving in susp set up nuances..and a little off could nmake their handling go a lil' astray easily..
the only very slight flaw i find in the 08 CRF250R is the typical midstroke mid valve harshness in Hondas forks is back?
the last few years seemed like they had finally addressed that demon a bit. but the 08s have a decent amount of it in the midstroke when stock.
luckily there are many good cures for it..
bob,
yeap! son is 12..
and literally grew up in a crib at the track.
i used to go to 50 events a year when he was a little guy , and he was always with me (we lost his mom, when he was only 8 months)
so he has been a trooper all his life ,about weekends at the track or traveling . He was so used to that, and SX /race events, that i dont think it really ever sank in? he just thought everyone had the same experiences? he ewas looney about races and riding from about 2, ,but burned out on it a bit by about 7..
now he seems to have the bug again this summer..
We went today dispite the forcast for severe thunderstorms,luckily dodged them, and got a HS race in.(rained before we got there and right after we left !!)
trails were good if a sliitle snotty on the up hills..
i got smoked , but we had a great fathers day.
I have put together that list before..(on a few forums)
i'll try to do so soon here. an dpost in a nother thread, i'm siure lots of guys have input on other chassis as well?
but essentially its much as Shannon stated,
each generation is a bit better.
in some gens/years its dramaticly better, ,
others gens/years just a slight improvement.
as slow old fart said-
for the exact type of riding one might prefer on egen to another though.
me? i do really like the gen 4 (CRF250) the best-
and especially the 08 , with the 22mm offset triples..
personally i feel that year simply out handles everything else , bar none.
its forgiving in set up , ergos are great for a motocross sized dude like me (5'8 150 pounds on a good rainy day)
i'm completely in love with the 08 (CRF250R) chassis,and it works remarkably well with the 500 tossed in it.you can pretty easily knife inside any thumper out there.
There where years that i really liked and could get dialed, but were less forgiving in susp set up nuances..and a little off could nmake their handling go a lil' astray easily..
the only very slight flaw i find in the 08 CRF250R is the typical midstroke mid valve harshness in Hondas forks is back?
the last few years seemed like they had finally addressed that demon a bit. but the 08s have a decent amount of it in the midstroke when stock.
luckily there are many good cures for it..
bob,
yeap! son is 12..
and literally grew up in a crib at the track.
i used to go to 50 events a year when he was a little guy , and he was always with me (we lost his mom, when he was only 8 months)
so he has been a trooper all his life ,about weekends at the track or traveling . He was so used to that, and SX /race events, that i dont think it really ever sank in? he just thought everyone had the same experiences? he ewas looney about races and riding from about 2, ,but burned out on it a bit by about 7..
now he seems to have the bug again this summer..
We went today dispite the forcast for severe thunderstorms,luckily dodged them, and got a HS race in.(rained before we got there and right after we left !!)
trails were good if a sliitle snotty on the up hills..
i got smoked , but we had a great fathers day.
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quantum500
- Posts: 193
- Joined: April 21st, 2008, 9:44 pm
Thanks in advance for doing this and I am looking forward to reading it.AJ wrote:exnav-
I have put together that list before..(on a few forums)
i'll try to do so soon here. an dpost in a nother thread, i'm siure lots of guys have input on other chassis as well?
Money ain't got no owners, only spenders - Omar Little
-
Slow old Fart
- Posts: 444
- Joined: February 12th, 2008, 6:19 am
