nikasil honed with torque plate

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 26th, 2009, 9:52 am

I'm about to get my bore nikasiled. When I read that they want the jug without the studs I realized that they are not using a torque plate. I'm talking about powerseal usa in PN. Millennium Technologies doesn't use the plates either. Does anyone know where I can buy one?

I guess I could have one made or borrow one if anyone has an extra.

Both companies claim it is NOT necessary. They say it's for harleys or cylinders that have bolts that go thru the cylinder to the case.

lewisclan · Post by **lewisclan** » March 26th, 2009, 10:11 am

I had Pete loomis contact & bore my cyl to the milmum spec before it was sent. milmum just diamond honed it to a finish

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 26th, 2009, 10:15 am

lewisclan wrote:I had Pete loomis contact & bore my cyl to the milmum spec before it was sent. milmum just diamond honed it to a finish

Huh

Both companies told me they bore about .008 out then apply the coating and hone to final size. The point is if they don't hone with the plate then having it bored with a plate won't matter.

lewisclan · Post by **lewisclan** » March 26th, 2009, 11:26 am

just letting ya know what I did with mine

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 26th, 2009, 12:32 pm

lewisclan wrote:just letting ya know what I did with mine

This is the part I didn't get "contact & bore" ???

fastkart · Post by **fastkart** » March 26th, 2009, 1:31 pm

I'm guessing he had Pete Loomis contact millenium for the specs and bore the cyl...

pstoffers · Post by **pstoffers** » March 26th, 2009, 3:18 pm

fastkart wrote:I'm guessing he had Pete Loomis contact millenium for the specs and bore the cyl...

lewisclan · Post by **lewisclan** » March 26th, 2009, 4:54 pm

thats correct

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 26th, 2009, 6:22 pm

My original post was off by one word. "NOT" The nikaseal companies I talked with say it's NOT necessary to use a plate.

I don't know if Jay had pete send it over with a torque plate or not. Has anyone ever been able to measure a difference between a bore bores done w/ plates and without? I've been told that the blow by on a worn cylinder is from the distortion created by the extra head at the stud from the lack of circulation of coolant where the stud is.

I just set up a crank at STR for a specific weight piston and want a top end that will last. The piston has been coated for longer life as well.

100hp honda · Post by **100hp honda** » March 26th, 2009, 7:40 pm

the plating is .002 ? so they bore it .005-.006 bigger than the piston then put on the plating to get the .003-.004 clrearance ?

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 27th, 2009, 4:58 am

100hp honda wrote:the plating is .002 ? so they bore it .005-.006 bigger than the piston then put on the plating to get the .003-.004 clrearance ?

I'll have to check but I think the plating is thicker than .002

From a jug that's allready setup they told me they take it down another .008 then build it up and hone for the fit.

http://www.youtube.com/user/500bigbore · Post by **Roostius_Maximus** » March 27th, 2009, 7:01 am

I had a cyl at .75 needed to be bored, so one night i went at it. didnt have a piston, so i stayed shy of finish size, but did hone it as if the piston was .003 small so i wouldnt sacrifice a size. It measured round and fine, then installed my torque plate, could measure .00015 to.0002 difference, stuck the hone in wrapped in 800 paper to make a print of the high spots and you could see it in the top of the bore, starting about 5mm down, and going about 20mm down from that, at the head studs. Of course my hands were dirty like unreal so no pics.

Post by **AlisoBob** » March 27th, 2009, 8:13 am

Good machine work makes all the difference...

This is my jug AFTER running it for two years.... I had to pop the head off to modify it for my A/F conversion.

No indications the piston ever touched the cylinder wall..... no scratches, no scoring, no wear..... nothing.

Torque plating is the only way to go.

'927 helps too.....

http://www.youtube.com/user/500bigbore · Post by **Roostius_Maximus** » March 27th, 2009, 8:26 am

Post by **AlisoBob** » March 27th, 2009, 9:51 am

Roostius_Maximus wrote:nice

Not so nice

http://www.bannedcr500riders.com/board/ ... .php?t=200

Do it once, do it right.... Send you jug to Roosty.....

lewisclan · Post by **lewisclan** » March 27th, 2009, 9:57 am

Nope no plate was sent with the cyls

http://www.youtube.com/user/500bigbore · Post by **Roostius_Maximus** » March 27th, 2009, 10:03 am

ride it home from the valley with no water and it looks like a stopsign too, hahaha

pstoffers · Post by **pstoffers** » March 27th, 2009, 10:08 am

If you don't have a torque plate for the bottom of the cylinder the top one is a waste of time

Post by **AlisoBob** » March 27th, 2009, 10:11 am

The bottom is "clamped" by the studs in the case.... theres no distortion.

pstoffers · Post by **pstoffers** » March 27th, 2009, 10:13 am

AlisoBob wrote: theres no distortion.

OKaaaaaa

Post by **AlisoBob** » March 27th, 2009, 10:18 am

pstoffers wrote: OKaaaaaa

How do you see it?

exackery · Post by **exackery** » March 27th, 2009, 6:19 pm

I'm kinda a skeptic myself. The studs thread into cast aluminum with a sleeve of steel pressed into it. They only go into the cast alum an inch or so. The steel sleeve continues uninterrupted out the bottom at which there are four studs applying more pressure (higher torque) in a different pattern further warping the sleeve?

Do you think 20 ft lbs is enough to make a ripple in the steel sleeve at each stud? Better yet the ripple disappears when undo the 20 ft lb nut?

I think more likely the picture with the deposits where the studs are has been caused by a difference in temperature in the combustion chamber at those locations.
Kinda the way there are usually some deposits on the piston at the exhaust port --> temperature difference

Don't get me wrong it can't hurt and maybe in a different applications torqued studs could make a big difference. I just disagree thats its necessary in our case (stock 500).

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 27th, 2009, 6:23 pm

thanks for the link bob. I have read it several times thus my concern. Thanks adam that's what I really wanted to know. Now I gotta decide if I'm gonna build one myself with a machineist help or send it to someone. The powerseal folks say they will bore and hone with it if I provide the plate. I gotta get some other machine work done so maybe that's the way to go.

I priced a case of 927 this week $200 with my break. awk.

Guess I should read some more on that. I've run synthetic since the 80's.

http://www.youtube.com/user/500bigbore · Post by **Roostius_Maximus** » March 28th, 2009, 7:25 am

I'll make plates to sell if guys want, Need a couple days to get em ready. I'll make bottom end ones too if theres call for 'em

The Head end plates will just be round instead of the whole plate style like i use, Mine is big because i hold the jug by it

seanmx57 · Post by **seanmx57** » March 30th, 2009, 10:27 am

AlisoBob wrote:
pstoffers wrote: OKaaaaaa
How do you see it?

X2 ?

Bob is that antisieze on the studs of your cylinder?

BannedCR500Riders.com

nikasil honed with torque plate

nikasil honed with torque plate

hmmmm